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Studio # 121 - April 1997
Interview : JP Lavoignat and C. d'Yvoire
Photo : Luc Roux
Translation : Corinne

Last month we introduced you to Johnny Depp, the director. This month, in Donnie Brasco, he portrays an undercover FBI agent who infiltrates the mob. Based on a true story. For us, the actor met his source of inspiration.

Back to the 70's.
FBI agent, Joe Pistone, is sent on an undercover mission to infiltrate the New Yorker mob. For six years (a record in the police files), under the name of Donnie Brasco, Pistone is really going to become someone important in the bosom of the big octopus (Translation : that's how we call the Mafia in French " une grande pieuvre " for it has ramifications everywhere and that all begins from a same center such as an octopus with its tentacles, but maybe there is a special word for this in English, but I must admit I'm not that good at mob history ! ! ! !) before sending to jail a hundred of mafioso. A stunning success that forced Pistone and his family to live since that day a clandestine life : there is a $ 500,000 dollars bounty on him. Almost 15 years later after this happened, director Mike Newell ("4 weddings and a funeral") made a magnificent film in which Depp portrays Pistone and Al Pacino is playing the part of Lefty the unlucky mafioso who trusted Pistone. For a short stay in Paris, Johnny Depp and Joe Pistone, (his face hidden behind large sunglasses and a fake moustache not to be recognized) met just for us.

Studio (to Joe Pistone) : What was your first feeling when you watched the movie for the first time ?
Joe Pistone : I was deeply removed. It's really weird to see on screen what you have lived in real life, but most of all it's really disturbing to see yourself played by someone else. For you know, Johnny portrayed a genuine me by bringing on screen accurate and very intimate details.

Studio : Did the fact that you "replayed" your story on screen scared you or have you taken a certain distance with this period of your life ?
Joe Pistone : No, it's really like if you were watching 6 years of your life going by in front of your eyes.

Studio : Would you say you as the original model and you as the actor portraying it that in a certain way you do the same job as an undercover agent ?
Joe Pistone : … hum…
Johnny Depp : see, you should have been an actor. (Laughter) Joe Pistone : Right, at least you get five takes and I was only allowed to get one … (laughter)

Johnny Depp : Creating a character for the cinema is one thing but performing one in real life is another one. On one hand you have someone faking and there will be no consequence about it. On the other, the least error you do can become a matter of life or death. Joe experienced this situation, I never did. When we first met we talked about this for quite a long time. How do you manage to get yourself into someone else's body. Joe Pistone : Of course it's not only about disguising. You really have to transform yourself, otherwise it's unbearable.

Studio : But actors do also know this feeling for they use what's deep inside of them to become someone else.
Johnny Depp : Yes but it depends on the character. As far as I'm concerned, I always try to do something a little bit different every time, and this movie has been the greatest challenge I have ever had to face for obviously I had a tremendous sense of responsibility towards Joe. I had to be totally honest.

Studio : Was it the most difficult thing to do according to you ?
Johnny Depp : Yes and especially I didn't want to upset him… (laughter) Living six years infiltrated among gangsters isn't necessarily a smooth thing. I can promise you this dude is rather tough … No, seriously, Joe has a personality absolutely unique. First time we met we started by getting to know each others. He allowed me from the first minute to tape our conversations and I studied them for a long time for he has a very specific way of talking. He doesn't have the New Yorker accent but more one sounding like the Jersey one or the Pennsylvanian one, it's really amazing. But the real thing that really impressed me when I first faced him was his stature. I told to myself : "Oh my God ! I will have to work out a little !" And so I started at once body building and ate everything that was passing by. (Laughter)
Joe Pistone : You strolled with a glass in your hand ! (Laughter)
Johnny Depp : I was drinking milk shakes all the time in order to put on weight;

Studio (to Joe Pistone) : What was your first impression when you met Johnny Depp for the first time ?
Joe Pistone : Well I thought OK, he's handsome enough to portray me ! (Laughter) No, actually I was really glad. We had this long talk and at once there was no doubt he was a good guy. He interrogated me a lot, such as : Why would I have wanted to become an FBI agent ? What was my family reaction because of this decision ? And so on and so forth … Actually, he was very professional that obviously meant he cared a lot for sticking to the real me and that he didn't considered this part like any other one.

Johnny Depp : First time I saw Joe I expected to see someone perfectly hardened and who wouldn't show any emotion; For I did read his book ("Donnie Brasco" Press Pocket - to French readers) that is fascinating but also really well written in a factual style : boom, boom, boom and here is what happened. I doesn't stay too long on the feelings. So I figured this guy with a kind of computer in his head, a sort of perfect technician. So I was deeply surprised to meet someone so opened, so sensitive and I'd rather say over sensitive. He has this tremendous capacity to listen to others, that's amazing. Actually, the first time I met him I was wondered how you succeeded in surviving all of this. And, to tell you the truth, it's a question that's still on my mind. For, what we all know, you are the only undercover agent who went that far.
Joe Pistone : That's exactly what I was saying few minutes ago, the secret is being yourself. And overall, do not disguise yourself. I also think that when you are in this kind of operation, you must have a strong personality that fits you : you mustn't fear loneliness, you must have a great knowledge of who you are and be very self-confident. You mustn't give a damn about what the others think about you. You must be able to make decision in a really short amount of time, and so on and so forth.
Johnny Depp : That is something really amazing about you: your terrific determination, for anything. When you decide you will do something, you just do it no matter what happens. I've never seen this in anyone else.

Studio : Let's go back to the metaphor of the actor and the undercover agent, have you ever one or the other felt the danger of loosing yourself ?
Johnny Depp : I don't know, to me being an actor is like living a blessed existence. You know, having the chance to do something I'm really fond about and being paid for that, that is a very lucky. Psychologically and emotionally speaking, I've often thought that the acting job was kind of insane. I do not believe that playing comedy comes from a natural process but once more it is not the worst job. When you know the sacrifice Joe accepted, especially about his family and his relatives, that's really something compared to the little trouble you can get from portraying a character.
Joe Pistone : I think the real difference lies in the fact that at the end of the day the job of the actor is over. For the undercover agent it's a little bit different for him the job is never over, he has no pause or rest to recover. It's impossible to say : OK, now I'm going out with pals and relax and I'll come back to it tomorrow.

Studio : You happened to be often on the set.
Joe Pistone : I was there when Johnny had some scenes to be shot.
Johnny Depp : That was something really important to me. When you are so lucky to portray someone who is still alive, obviously having him next to you is a source of inspiration, an genuine treasure. Each day, I used to discuss with him about the scene I was about to do and all he said to me brought me a tremendous perspective. On the contrary, when he felt I was kind of lost, he was always there to support me and correct my mistake so I could stick to his character. It has been an amazing opportunity for me having him on the set just for me. For in a certain way I was acting for him. I wanted to accomplish something with this movie not only for him, but also for his wife and his children. For, nowadays they still live with the weight of this experiment. And you know, Joe can be really funny, and we had a lot of fun together. (Laughter)
Joe Pistone : We sure did. We also ate well. (Laughter) For, you know, many of the people who worked on that movie had Italians roots. I, personally, cooked, my mom did it too and we brought all the stuff on the set.
Johnny Depp : One day we had all these meals prepared by Joe's mom, and by Louis Digiamo's, the producer, and then it was the turn of his step-mother…
Joe Pistone : Then, Al Pacino started cooking too…

Studio : They shot the movie on the exact location of your mission. What were your feelings like coming back on the same place ?
Joe Pistone : It reminded me a lot of memories, pleasant ones and others not at all.

Studio : Were you scared ?
Joe Pistone : No; But, there was this day while we were shooting in Little Italy, that guy came to me and said : "I know who you are, you are the one who put us in jail. You are Donnie Brasco." So, I pointed my finger at Johnny, who was next to me and said : "No, I'm not Donnie Brasco, he is …" I'm not sure the guy really understood that joke…
Johnny Depp : That is the only time this kind of incident happened. It disturbed me and at the same time I knew all the precautions had been taken to protect Joe.

Studio : Was the real Lefty very different from the one Al Pacino portrays ?
Joe Pistone : No. Al got the real essence of him. Of course, he performs him in his way but the essential of his personality is there.

Studio (to Johnny Depp) : You knew Al Pacino before acting with him in this movie ?
Johnny Depp : I met him briefly on a special occasion. That was three years ago, at the Academy Awards ceremony… We were backstage and I had to come on stage to introduce someone. I was surrounded by, let's say, hundreds, no thousands of movie stars and the only guy who looked just as ill at ease as me was Pacino. Someone introduced us to each other and we exchanged a few words. He said "Are you scared ? " I answered : "Yes, and what about you ?" So he went (he imitates Al Pacino's deep voice) : "Oh yeah!". When we met next it was to talk about the movie. Al is this unbelievable guy. The work he's done on Donnie Brasco is exceptional. Really, he's a master.

Studio : Is there anything you haven't dare to ask to Joe since you've met him ?
Johnny Depp : No, but there is this question that's still on my mind when I read the book and before I met Joe and that will be "How could he betray Lefty ?" But, to tell the truth, it's not a matter of betrayal. Joe has never been a member of the Mafia, he's always been an FBI agent. From the beginning, he gave himself this mission to accomplish and that was fighting the mob and till the end he stuck to his word. In the movie, some of the Mafia members betray their fellowship. For Joe, it's really something different he was just doing his job. And I believe that even in the Mafia he got a kind of respect for doing his job to the end. And that is something I really wanted to be clear and that's one of the reason why I asked him a lot about this subject when we first met.

Studio : According to you, is he a hero ?
Johnny Depp : Definitively yes. To me he is the answer to this eternal question you ask yourself when you are a child : "What is a man supposed to be ?" You know, this kind of big question you ask yourself, looking at your dad. Joe succeeded in being this ideal. With no hesitation, no fear, he's done it. And that makes him definitively a hero.

Studio (to Joe Pistone) : Do you agree with this statement ?
Joe Pistone : Oh yes, for sure. It sounds great doesn't it ? (Laughter).